https://www.theguardian.com/travel/2019/jul/21/yorkshire-dales-all-electric-classic-vw-campervan Hey @Dicky given the newspaper I assume you have already read it
We've passed the point of no return - the UK has positioned itself as leaders in the environmental race, so make the most of the Historic vehicle exemptions while they last - there's no way the targets we are setting will allow dirty smoky vans to remain on the road. I give it 5 years before Historic exemption is either withdrawn, restricted to genuinely rare models, or have use restrictions applied to them.
You’ll end up on some form of branch line road like steam trains....I’d imagine cars will be self driven pods that you merely sit in so no run for these lumps under human control getting in the way. This assumes we don’t end up as I actually imagine our future....brains in jars or slaves to tyrannical AI overlords that speak like Texas Instruments Speak and Spells or KITT.
I'm a turncoat on this one. Originally harboured plans to have one, all original, looks-like-a-trailer-queen-but-isn't for weddings ... and one well restored but meant for daily and leasurely coastal touring, with electric conversion ...... They might be fine for a 20% reduction in LOCAL emissions but Lithium batteries (despite the full recycling that Tesla is supposedly doing) are the spawn of the devil in ecology terms, so I just can't do it! Anyone know how to post PDF on here?
If it were closer, I would hire it for the experience. Good point made about the scourge of Lithium mining. The way things are going petrol is going to get much more expensive and soon we will be 10% Ethanol. Our old vans are thirsty and not fuel efficient. At the moment tax free helps to offset the running costs. But our vans pollute the air and maybe in the future we would have a mileage restriction and a ban on driving in cities. Hopefully the dispute with Iran would be resolved peacefully as nobody wants to see a disruption in crude oil supplies from the Gulf, which would escalate fuel prices.
Really Holland, Germany,Sweden and Norway just to name a few are miles ahead of us on environmental issues, energy generation and usage and recycling and have been for years. No one let alone government care about a very few old vehicles that do very limited miles they only gave us historical status so they can go after the 10,15 year old cars and make us buy new cars to put money in their pockets.
Its not the right to own a camper van, its the way we are being persuaded that electric cars are any part of a low energy future. The low energy future is one where we stop doing things instead of carrying on the same. After all with modern electronic communications there is really no need for a lot of people to ever have to travel further than a long days walk from home.. Part of the reason I can feel justified in using a camper van is that I havent flown in a plane for about 10 years...
Yes, really. British has targeted and reduced its greenhouse gas emissions more than those countries since 2015, culminating in a zero emissions target by 2050. Historic vehicle status is actually encouraging people to take to the roads more often. Be honest, did anyone ever expect to drive around in a camper without having pay tax or pass an MOT every year?
Since those very desirable changes in behaviour are a way off it would be good if someone experienced in "cradle to grave" ecological analysis were to compare the "lifecycle" of a Bay to that of a new electric vehicle ... "Best practice" in "green" building is to refurbish existing buildings wherever possible (less road miles, less landfill, less new materials etc etc) so I wonder how converting a bay, or even keeping the original i c e on the road, would stack up against a new EV ...... Then the case could be made if the Gov gets all holier than thou about classics?
It's an interesting one. If I drive my bay for say the next 10 years doing say 5,000 miles a year, how does that stack up against my brother who probably does double that mileage in a brand new car that seems to get replaced every 3-4 years with another new one? I won't have used significant amounts of energy in manufacturing the 2-3 cars he may get through, but obviously the van is not as efficient as a modern car.
Zero emissions is just pie in the sky thinking and can not ever be achieved and they know it. The British plan to reduce emissions is just playing catch-up with others that have all ready done it rather than leading it. Look up the emissions per population of the country’s above especially Norway and you will see.
Leaving all that aside, is that a rear hinged Westy in the Graun article? If it is they don’t look right to me without the roof rack at the front. Just saying like.....
Using people as a basis may not be calculable ... To take your person-to-person comparison, the full lifespan of those two to three cars of your brother's, long after he's finished with them, would have to be taken into account. Also it would probably have to be a mile for mile comparison as well to be relevant, given the variables from person to person, and maybe changes in behaviour across the population as a whole ... At least with a comparison of a classic vs an EV, where the whole point is to make a decision about which is the best decision "moving forward", the timeline for the classic starts now. The manufacture has already happened. The materials have already been mined and processed. The miles have already been done. I would expect the maintained classic to stand up well against a new vehicle, even with all the improvements in efficiency, and particularly well against EV. There's probably a calculable point at which the lines cross on the graph because of a classic's emissions, but who knows where that point would be?
But that's exactly the point - the UK setting and reducing emissions from a high point to zero is exceeding the ongoing and planned reductions of those countries so will need to look for and eliminate as many sources as possible. As I said previously - did anyone honestly think they'd ever be allowed to run their Smokey old vans at nil cost and with no MOT to gauge their emissions ?
