Discussion in 'Restorations' started by theBusmonkey, Jan 2, 2014.

  1. More of a tart up than a full resto. but some may find what we're doing of interest.
    Thanks in advance for all the help & advice from forum members so far......
    Won't make much progress until 3rd week of Jan as we have lots to do elsewhere before then.
    However, been over to workshop today & had a play with wood etc. so though I'd get stuff out of my head:thinking:
    The plan:
    Sub floor & floor.
    Cabinets reworked in the Westy style: same layout but slightly extended over bed cupboard, high level cupboards over kitchen, reworked wardrobe to accommodate electrical gubbins at rear. Top bed will have storage running along each long side. We only use it singly so don't need full width. Kitchen will use Westy sink/hob but RHS wheel cupboard will be wider to accommodate Gas-It refillable propane locker.
    OG fridge for time being. OG bed hinges. Bit of upholstery & curtain action etc.

    Spare from front to rear
    Underslung Propex & vent modification
    Roof mounted solar
    Water pump socket
    Bit of touching up here & there
    Under-seal ???

    Engine Bay
    tidy rats nest wiring
    replace battery cables/earths etc & split relay
    Bigger leisure battery
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
    paradox likes this.
  2. Sooo, we start with this:

    The units have been taken out & all fixings saved, then put back in for measuring depth of fit etc. Floors out.
    P1040184.jpg P1040185.jpg

    Engine bay a mess & I'm ashamed when I see some of yours. (OG colour Dakota magnolia, love it). Spare well marked for cut to allow for 125amp leisure battery.

    Underneath the propex will go here as the Westy has a feeder vent welded into the floor under the R&R bed.
    Cool air in will either come from main tube or from walkthrough vent.
    It is tight on the left, by the loom tube & brake cable guide & I'm waiting for Propex to reply to my question of exhaust port temp so we can decide if the area needs lagging.

    Solar panels arrived over Xmas. 2 x 90w flexible thin film technology. They come bonded to steel with a mastic backing so we will probably bond them to ally & fix this to the roof. 2m long x 50cm wide each. They will lay flat & follow the curves of the roof. I'd like them demountable for when parked in shade but we need to work out security.
    P1040183.jpg P1040187.jpg

    Tested them today, laying flat. Shadows long as you can see but they instantly put out 21.6 V. Well happy. I hope for about 10amps/hour average (theoretical 15) into the leisure battery through a MPPT 3 stage charger/controller.

    Under-seal peeling under slider & it looks like a pig of a job but the underside is good so probably worth it.

    Testing solvent based adhesive today with high pressure laminate.
    P1040175.jpg P1040189.jpg

    We are using a very, very lightweight ply (340kg/m³). It's not commonly used here yet, being lighter than poplar so it's a bit of an experiment. BTW for those of you who are interested the board is EN636-2 & is bonded with an exterior phenolic resin to EN314-2 (@vanorak ;)). So all should be well in the potentially humid/hot etc van environment.
    By using the spray bonding system we can have a massive choice of laminate for the cupboards & it's not that expensive when compared to pre-bonded sheet from timber merchants. More to follow when I next get over to the workshop.
    Proper excited & can't wait to get stuck in.........:thumbsup:
    Kruger, Clive Neilands and paradox like this.
  3. sANDYbAY

    sANDYbAY On benefits-won't sponsor!

    I was going to say lots of things about your plans and how good they are, I was also going to suggest a lower height battery to avoid chopping the spare wheel well.

    But then I noticed that you appear to have ironed your overall sleeves. :eek:
  4. HAHAHAH...Good spot.

    I'm pleased to say that that's the glue rep. He had a tie on as well! We got him in to spray up this fandango board so we can do some peel strength tests on the finished laminate before I buy the bits in:thumbsup:
  5. ....& I can't find a half decent flooded wet cell battery (don't want to go Gel or AGM coz. they're still not as good) with big amp capacity & low case height that doesn't foul the well.:( Anyone recommend one?
  6. Baysearcher

    Baysearcher [secret moderator]

    The Elecsol 110 fits under the spare wheel well no problem.
    Probably one of the best batteries out there according to reviews.
    vanorak and theBusmonkey like this.
  7. Cheers @Baysearcher . It's not a bad price either from Tanya. Terminals wrong way round but we can deal with that & AGM fits the engine regulator/solar charge profile better than Gel. Can be discharged lower than wet cell so more useable amps, even better. Good spot :thumbsup:
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2014
  8. What's wrong with Gel I got a 115 (or could have been 125) Amp gel battery 5 year warranty. Seems ideal to me?

    I also had the wheel well cut out which makes it much easier to lift battery in & out.
  9. Nothing really @Razzyh , it's just that the chemistry of a gel battery means it has a slightly different charge profile to flooded wet cells. It's to do with the silica material that the electrolyte is suspended in. Most voltage regulators (unless they are "smart") won't correctly charge the battery so the theoretical life is shortened. That's why smart chargers often have a battery selection feature so you can dial in whether it's FLA, Gel or AGM. Also, it's really best practise to have the same type of battery for both leisure and starter. Again only to get max use out of them & in practise you probably won't notice with occasional camping use.
    In use, yours will be fine. Remember, we tend to live in the van for longer periods so our kit gets proper hammer. Don't worry.:thumbsup:
  10. Cool thanks dude.
    theBusmonkey likes this.
  11. looks like you've got your head around the bulk of the work there @theBusmonkey ! The plyboard you're using will be great for constructing units....basically, the timber provides a base for the bonding, so it's the glue, rather than the timber that provides the strength and moisture resistance. Ages ago, we designed and built a prototype 'Hostess trolleys' for Singapore Airlines, that had to have an exact capacity and dimensions, but come in under a certain unladen weight. We used aircraft grade aluminium for the framework, titanium fixings and latches and plastic honeycomb board for the keep the exterior looking smart we ended up boding HPL to Aluminium sheet, on both sides...won the contract and made about fifty of them at around £1K a unit:thumbsup:

    Anyway I digress...when you're doing the bonding, make sure to have atleast 1 water filter off the compressor outlet and a 'last chance' line filter before your gun, and try to keep the temperature up in the workshop...spraying adhesive can form a layer over any tiny water droplets and you won't know they're there....

    Loving the flexi panels.....saving up for some myself. If you're running the Propex with the heated air outlet towards the rear, why not run insulated ducting thru the wheel tub, up through the rear wardrobe and have the intake vent as high as possible....? (assuming you're having a tall rear wardrobe)

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    I took some pics of the over unit locker (as mentioned in another thread). It may not be what you're planning, but it illustrates one way of fabricating a superlight locker. I didn't want timber above the stove so made the body out of aluminium. The sliding doors reduce intrusion (3mm veneered ply), the end pieces are 9mm...The last pic shows the rebate so the curtains can be drawn behind it....I wanted as big a locker as possible, due to lost storage space from the full width and slimline unit.....
    Lardy and theBusmonkey like this.
  12. Sweet, love the ideas @vanorak .
    The spray system is airless! Runs off a pre-charged 17kg cannister. So simple, even I can do it!
    P1040173.jpg P1040177.jpg

    We are LHD so running the flex hose for the air inlet is a bit of a head scratcher. I can't see how I could run up the tub & get to the cabinet on theRHS (looking backwards) without it being a real mess under there. I spent about an hour the other day just lying on my back trying to figure it out! It's tight & I'm considering another tube, next to the OG Westy vent, into the bed space. BUT that takes extra storage space & means cutting more holes.....I think the JK solution can be improved upon assuming there is a vent (vent kit)!! available to tee up under the bed for the warm air in, it's just the cool return that's a problem.
    I've also asked Propex min & max air temps on return flow so I don't fry the circuit board with air in from the HX.

    @Dicky has offered to bob across to help me straighten out my head. :)
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2014
  13. sANDYbAY

    sANDYbAY On benefits-won't sponsor!

    Here's the one I bought earlier this year and I've included some Elephans in the picture to give you an idea of the scale.


    And here it is in the van, I haven't altered the terminals and you can see there is ample room between the positive terminal and the wheel well.


    The black marks you can see on the bottom of the wheel well is underseal overspray.
  14. @Mabel could easily catch them!
    Cheers @sANDYbAY , whats the capacity of the battery? Please. Neil
  15. Put the propex on the opposite side to the seat vent and use flexi to this....? You don't really want to be swapping storage space for 'air' so to speak.
    HX would be too hot IMO but you never'd probably find the unit would keep shutting itself off...
    By cool air return I'm assuming you mean the large recirculated inlet next to the heated air outlet....
  16. so your tall rear wardrobe is above the wheel tub? your under seat westy vent is on the passenger's side (LHD bus)?
  17. Here's a leftfield suggestion....recirculate the air from the back of the fridge (if you have a top fridge vent)
  18. Yeah that's right, cool air into unit not combustion air inlet. I too suspect HX air too hot. I'm unlikely (never) to run propex whilst engine running so it may be an academic worry too far on my part!
    A neat little forward facing 30' "T" into the main tube would probably work OK.

    The tall cabinet is above the spare wheel well. The vent I will use for hot air in is central to the van under the R&R bed. These late Westy's have a little black vent under the drop down access door under the bed. There is a triangular deflector plate above the vent. OG there is a long tube which "T"s off the walk through vent heat & runs towards the rear & into the tube as in the pic above. (sorry if you know that already)
    There is no room for the propex unit on the drivers side underneath due to a load of service cables etc running under the van:(
  19. Good suggestion, don't stop! OG Westy chest fridge (absorption therefore 12v only) drawing 5.4 amps (the need for solar & big battery etc).
    Could try & get a hose under there but no neat easy path from propex without big hanging radius under centre tube.
  20. On the walkthru set-up, the larger outlet carries diverted HX air to the smaller inlet on the opposite side (which you'll already know, having spent an hour on your back sussing it all out) My plan is to mount the propex roughly where you are and run a length of insulated duct direct to the walkthru inlet (with the HX diverter outlet blocked obviously) How about you use the under floor seat vent as your recirculated air intake, by running a length of duct along the back edge behind the seat, and up into the nearest side unit? i'm not 100% it will make that much difference, but simple laws of physics dictate that hot air heated air added as low as possible (walkthru) and warm recirculated air drawn from as high as possible.....IMO

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