I'm trying to register my van in France and the historic vehicle people have raised a question about the engine size. According to the UK docs and the previous owner the original 1.7 type 4 was replaced with a 1.8. Everything, including some VW specialists who worked on the carbs, seems to confirm that but the number on the engine casing says it is a 2 litre. How likely is it that the number on the casing is wrong? I could say that I don't know the engine number but that does complicate matters which isn't usually the best option with French bureaucrats. The other option is to tell them that the English got it wrong which might well prove popular as long as mis-matched engines and casings aren't that unusual. Any help would be much appreciated!
Not unknown for engines to be rebuilt with another case and not change the engine code ,especially 2.1 WBX engines which tended to disagree with the their con rods and where rebuilt with 1.9 cases.
Normally people have the opposite problem. The fact is that as far as authorities are concerned it is 2.0L. So this means that you can entirely legally update it in the future to match the engine number rather than the French VW owner trick of building a bigger engine look to like a smaller one for the authorities.
Seems to be an Australian trick as well!!!! ask he how I know, I had a spare set of 1800 Barrels for a couple of years that I did not need!!!
Thanks to you both. Sounds like my best course of action is to just point out the mismatch between the docs and the engine number and let them decide. I know they refuse to give historic status to vans with something modern a Subaru engine in but as it is a standard motor for a T2 from the right period hopefully it will be OK. Don't think there is much advantage in hiding a big motor over here anymore - if your VW is too old to get a certificate of conformity you have to go down the historc vehicle registration route which costs the same regardless of engine capacity.
Try to register it in France with whatever engine number it states on the UK V5c but unfortunately FFVE (if they are the historic vehicle people you used) will know what the engine size should be using the year the bus was manufactured and if it was originally a 1700 and it’s now an 1800 they will smell a rat, regardless of whether it is perfectly legal and correctly registered in the UK. I had no problems whatsoever registering mine although the fan shroud is the only number that matches the documents and my bus has had at least five engines.
What capacity does it state on the V5c? Does the engine number match the V5C? Does the number on the shroud (the easy one to see) match the engine number? FFVE will have the VW homologation for the year of your bus from the VIN and that will state what the engine capacity should be. Deviate from that capacity, bigger or smaller, and the bus no longer complies with the original specification.
It’s not a matter of hiding a big motor; it’s a matter of matching numbers to obtain the Carte grise de collection. I hope I’m wrong but I’ll be surprised if you can convince FFVE that your bus complies with the original specification if you point out the mismatch between the docs and the engine number. Incidentally, where in France are you?
That sounds a bit worrying, maybe I should just say engine number unknown and give them the measurements? This is my first Type 4 motor so I was only using the number on the shroud. Is there anywhere else to look? I know it was originally a 1700 but it arrived from the states with an 1800 that had replaced it. The UK docs say 1800 but number unknown. I'm in the south-west about an hour from Toulouse. If you've done this process before I'd appreciate any advice at all.
The other possibility is to tell them the puissance fiscale for an 1800 in which case I only need the VIN. No idea how to calculate that but the blokes at Speedshop near Toulouse will probably know it.
The engine number is on the crankcase down behind the shroud by the breather tower – it’s difficult to see. I’m a bit confused, is the shroud from a 1800 or 2.0l? If you don’t know what are the first two letters. If it’s registered as an 1800 on the V5C and the shroud is from a 1800 there shouldn’t be a problem, although it must be fitted with a later engine if it was originally a 1700. I doubt if you’ll get away with saying the engine number is unknown and what measurements would you give? All type 4 engines are the same size on the outside. You need to tell FFVE what they need to know and no more.
I can’t remember having to give the puissance fiscal for the Carte grise de collection, I’ll try to find the documents I submitted but FFVE might have given it. Don’t give it if they don’t need it. Make it as simple as possible.
Under no circumstances remind them that we had to sink their navy during the war, before they lent it to the Germans. Never goes down well.
Good advice from you both. I've checked the form and I only need to give the engine number if I don't know the puissance fiscale but I do have to give them one or the other. If I give them that for an 1800 it will match the UK paperwork. That won't quite match the VIN but everything to do with everything else will so I'll cross my fingers. I'll try to find the actual engine number as I reckon the one on the shroud is wrong which would explain why it is down as unknown on the V5. I work with a lot of German and French people so not mentioning anything WW2 related now comes naturally!
It’ll be interesting to know the engine number, it might be a 2.0l (crankcase) and the number on the shroud matches.
Haven't had the chace for a really thorough look but can't find anything except the number on the shroud after a quick rummage about. Went and got my quittus fiscal today so that made me feel like I'm making progress even though it was never goling to be a problem. Thanks for your help so far Westy. Think I'll be OK if I can avoid sending the engine code in!
If it’s a VW crankcase the number will be stamped by the breather tower, however the number won’t tell you what the capacity is unless the engine has never been overhauled. And if it’s been overhauled it may have had the engine number ground off. The number on the shroud tells you nothing.
^whs^ think having a look at the head part number will give you a bit more certainty.. but again heads can be opened out for bigger pots!
Hi rosco, you should have asked me! It was originally a 1.7 but was replaced with a 1.8 before I imported it. Since I imported I've had a few bits and pieces done, but not a change of engine case. I think that the engine in it was a rebuild from a couple of different engines, and I was ready to replace if it necessary, but it never was. It originally had a single Weber, I fitted the twins. It was never an issue over here. Hope all is still well.
Just re read your original post and now I see that you already knew that. Hope you get it all sorted.
