Bus rage - then turns into a discussion about EVs!

I wasn't referring specifically to yourself, but I'd be very interested to know why you feel so strongly that EV's are a "complete dead end" against all the evidence to the contrary at this point. At the very least it would appear they will stay an attractive option for a large percentage of car buyers going forward, even if the government were to back away from the new ICE car sales ban in 2030.

 

nope, the two studies i linked both take the current USA energy production mix, so only 23% of the electricity coming from renewables for the purposes of those calculation. uk has a much higher percentage from renewables btw.


Look, i'm absolutely not saying that ev's are awesome and we should all have one, far from it - i love our little ev and use it as often as i can, but i'm well aware of its shortcomings and how it won't work for everyone, that's why i still have my old honda diesel estate (although it hardly gets used now) and the camper. BUT it drives me nuts when i hear folks saying things that patently aren't correct - if you don't want an ev, fine by me, your choice etc

 

But there's the problem, we are told that having a EV is not going to be a choice.

 

you only buy cars new then do you? there'll still be plenty of choice - i've only ever bought cars used and the option to have a used ICE car is not going away. I'm in my 50's so i have maybe another 20 yrs or so of driving - i would expect there to still be lots of choice of used ICE cars for the duration of my driving life?

seems a lot of folks on this forum are in either the anti-ev camp or the pro-ev camp - honestly i'm neither - they are great for certain tasks and not great at others. i just get riled up when folks who obviously don't want/ like EV's use made up statistics to justify their position (they take 60k miles to pay back etc - not true). If you can't afford one, or they don't have the range you need, can't tow, no where to park, don't like being told what to do by governments, don't like change etc these are all valid reasons.

we seem to be WAY way off topic here re bob's road rage

 

we seem to be WAY way off topic here re bob's road rage :thinking

Yeah, but this is why I like this forum!

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Ok, been doing some digging. The break even point of CO2 does also depend on what the car is. A Tesla model 3 is indeed 13.5k miles so a good choice (bar the build quality). Volvo did a study where they looked at the ICE XC40 and it electric equivalent C40.

"When using the average global energy supply, a Volvo C40 Recharge will need to cover 68,300 miles (109,918 km) before it breaks even with the ICE XC40 — in this scenario, that’s over half of the car’s lifetime. However, over that lifespan, the EV will account for 15 percent fewer overall emissions than the ICE vehicle."

"Running the C40 on the EU28 electricity scenario doubles the overall reduction in emissions to 30 percent and reduces the breakeven point to 48,000 miles (77,248 km). And if you’re able to charge your C40 on renewable energy alone, the carbon footprint of the EV is half that of the ICE, breaking even in just over 30,000 miles (48,280 km)."

The XC40 and C40 are big cars, so not surprising that the break even point is much higher. Mazda have worked out that putting a smaller battery in its MX30 drops the break even point, but of course shortens the range.

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After 2035 if you want a 5 year old car what you going to buy.

 

yeah so i guess we're both right lol. just different numbers for different cars. i had it in my head the number was much lower but i guess that's because 60 grand + ev's are not something that's on my radar. goes to show all these mega priced mega heavy SUV electric vehicles are not in any way better for the planet. the best eco solution for most folks is actually just to keep the car you already have and run it for ever.

 

dude - i can't even think what i'm going to do after breakfast, let alone what i'm going to do in twelve years time


.. but i'm hoping it might be one of these:

 

Just to update you on the build quality. The 3 is now very good all round, at least the ones we get from China and Germany. The US build cars are still a little shonky though.

 

It seems the EV situation is like so many things today, people want to be extreme about it. You have one side wanting everyone in EV's tomorrow with all ICE cars crushed and the other side in denial that they'll ever 'catch on' hating them for no valid reason and usually ranting about how they'll all die just as soon as Hydrogen gets here which is the "real" future. (If only they knew how ludicrous this would be for light vehicles!)

As someone with a foot in both camps, it gets tedious arguing about it all the time. To me, if you can, and it suits your usage, get an EV, cleaner air is great if nothing else. If you can't, cool, but no need to be a silly billy about it!

 

If car makers made cheap little EVs for running to the shops or the 20 mile commute to work, I would be interested , but as every car is a 2 tonne battering ram with an entertainment system.. not really interested, I will drive my bus the few days a month I have to go to work.
I lent my 04 plate 45-50mpg diesel estate to my daughter. When she buys another car I want it back.

EVs are part of the solution. Not the only solution.

 

I have a 5 year old Toyota hybrid by the way, never needs charging

 

Stylish and practical!

 

Which one

 

Is that the new Tesla?

 

I've met Sir Clive. He was very...ginger.

 

That's Elon's dad John isn't it?

 

Similar hairstyle.