Starting when warmed up

Discussion in 'Mech Tech' started by Deefer66, Apr 22, 2018.

  1. She fires up great from cold... Mostly..but after getting nicely warmed up can take 5-6 seconds of turning over to fire up.. always worrying at the petrol station.

    Is this most likely needle valve letting a bit through so drowning a little?.. So pop a washer under it?

    Carbs sometimes do need priming from the electronic fuel pump after a long stand. Don't have petrol in oil so can't be too much and fuel pump probably stops it siphoning though from tank.

    Edit... Standard twin carb solex 2.0 Ltr...
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2018
  2. Poptop2

    Poptop2 Administrator

    Hot start issues. People usually fit a hot start relay. Read up on hot start issues and decide yourself if you need a relay or not.
     
    Deefer66 likes this.
  3. Unless you can smell a strong smell of petrol in the engine bay, then it is safe to assume you needles are fine.

    often on Type 4 engines Hot start issues are caused by a weak spark from bad coil or dizzy. I had a poor Petronix 3 system that was causing the same problem as you describe.

    Do you know what coil and dizzy you are using?

    Another thing to check is with the air cleaner off, check that after the engine starts the chokes are held open ajar.
     
    Deefer66 likes this.
  4. Thought hot starts were more for a starter issue but might do one anyway while I'm getting the leisure battery wiring in... leaving more juice for spark must help a bit.... Even if some on Samba get a bit worked up about them
    Never a strong smell but often has a bit of a wiff by the vents.(thought I'd throw one out there for Snotty ;-) )..Standard blue coil.. But painted black... Accuspark dizzy.. Both seem to put out plenty of spark to get it going in the first place.
     
  5. @Deefer66 i had the same problem may moons ago. Replaced the starter motor never had an issue again.
     
    Deefer66 likes this.
  6. Ta, just had it reconditioned for the rebuild a couple of years ago but as above hot start relay could help save juice?..
     
  7. 77 Westy

    77 Westy Supporter

    If the starter motor spins the engine over the same whether it is hot or cold it’s not an issue a ‘hot start relay’ will cure but if the starter motor is sluggish when hot then a relay might help.

    A ‘hot start relay’ (it should be called a starter motor relay IMO) won’t leave more juice for sparks but it should be fitted anyway. Also, to reduce voltage drop to the coil and to minimise load on the ignition switch an ignition relay should be fitted – that will provide more juice for the sparks. VW were penny pinching to not fit relays, but back then ignition switches were better quality and the half mile of cable going from the battery to the front of the bus and back again was new.
     
    Iain McAvoy and Deefer66 like this.
  8. ... What's the difference between a hot start and an ignition relay?
     
  9. Pudelwagen

    Pudelwagen Supporter

    A hot start relay only activates the solenoid direct from the battery. It won't affect how strongly the starter motor turns as the solenoid connects the starter motor directly to the battery in any case.

    I presume an ignition relay will connect the coil direct to the battery thus bypassing the miles of wire to the front and therefore putting more juice into the coil.

    Is this right?
     
    Deefer66 likes this.
  10. So two relays to fit then one for coil feed one for stater solenoid... To add to leisure battery relay job.. I can tidy up the fuel pump relay while I'm there... and check the needle valve in carb to make a day of it!
     
  11. mikedjames

    mikedjames Supporter

    Or change the ignition switch and forget the rest of the relay faffing.



    Dont forget that a hot VW engine usually tends to flood when restarted hot as it really does not need the squirt from the accelerator pump as you put your foot on the pedal.
    . So it needs a few seconds to suck out the extra fuel with your foot on the pedal to open the throttle to let lots of air in, before the mixture leans out to the point where it actually burns instead of dribbling out the exhaust.

    Its normal ..
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2018
    CuppaT2 and Deefer66 like this.
  12. Changed the ignition two years ago.....

    .... normal is worrying on a forecourt, there's enough trepidation built into any journey already. Though to be fair she did go the 150mile round trip to Anglesey without a murmur of bother.

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
     
  13. 77 Westy

    77 Westy Supporter

    A starter (hot start) relay is for the starter motor solenoid and an ignition relay is for the coil and anything else you might have connected to the coil – fuel pump etc.
     
    Deefer66 likes this.
  14. Ta..
    We had to take the fuel pump off the coil feed it was messing about with the electronic ignition making the running a bit lumpy found that thanks to @mikedjames and his magic osciloscope! Can't remember where I found a live now!.. Could've been the snail fan..
     

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