One for the electricians - 18th Edition courses

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Purple, Nov 11, 2019.

  1. Who are the building regs people? and do they visit sites to check on work being done? I called up the council to ask why some houses on the new build had landfill waste stacked up the side of the house as landscaping, with bituthene between house and the arsenic. Council said it was news to them and illegal. I asked the contractor about the waste and they said it was cheaper to rework it and use tanking to keep out the water and the waste. I heard that new builds can be bad, but this place is something else. The planning said the waste would be taken away and the houses would have Methane and CO2 gas removal systems, no chance, they are brick and tile, cavity walls filled with glass fibre roof insulation. Is that a high spec home insulation material as said in their glossy brochure?
     
    art b likes this.
  2. The management of new build developments seems to have got completely out of hand - local authorities used to send an officer to even small extensions to check your footings and before everything was closed up, but there's no way they do that now, I don't know if they even exist anymore? Everyone's seen the defects teams back around new housing estates, but my experience is that once a build is signed-off and handed over you'll struggle to get anyone back to do anything other than the bare minimum of rectification to get them through 12 months DLP and get their retention paid.

    This country has relied on the Victorian housing stock for far too long, but I'd never buy a house in a new development and I rather my boys live at home than buy one.
     
  3. Don't forget the 1930s :thumbsup:
     
    Purple likes this.
  4. The Regency Grange development is built on part of the old deep landfill which used to be a Victorian brick works with clay pits filled in the 1950's and 60's with any uncontrolled waste and capped with clay and planted with 3000 trees in 1965. Analysis of the waste borings prior to planning showed very high levels of Arsenic, Lead and Asbestos fibres along with a cocktail of other heavy metals and organics like Benzene. Some test drillings went down 20 metres and didn't reach the clay below.

    Interesting for me was to see the piling method to try to stabilise the made ground before foundations were laid.

    I have found the whole business somewhat disturbing and the big losers will be the folks buying the houses and not being told about the springs and waste beneath them which would impact them and may make their homes difficult to sell in the future.
     
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  5. Loada bright sparks init:eek:
     
  6. Im exactly the same, airport engineering and factoires yet i cant do extensions on domestic properties.. crazy.

    Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
     
    matty likes this.
  7. Dazza

    Dazza Eyebrow not high brow

    If your confident / competent with 7671 you should pass the exam after maybe a days refresher - revised editions only prove you know where to find things in the regs book.

    our place give the guys a few hours with a qualifying manager as a refresher - take the exam the next day and they’ve all passed with no problems .
     
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  8. Ok, any advice for the most suitable qualifications on these scenarios:

    * For someone looking to do local work, extensions, rewires, extra lights an sockets etc.
    * Working for a friend who builds and installs upmarket log cabins.
    * For someone wanting to work on wind and solar farm installations.

    The Part P guidance seems to be largely scare and bluff about who they would prefer does the work, but in reality it only requires the work to be done in accordance with Part P - provided it gets certified afterwards?
     
  9. Most proper electricians will not sign off other people’s work and why should they.

    Anything domestic that involves planning will need a part p certificate or building control will not sign off the whole works.

    anything else if something goes wrong you have to prove competency but you can be still be prosecuted for not complying with building regulations
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2019
  10. But how many actually are? None, I suspect.
     
    mgbman likes this.

  11. So what about Periodic Inspection certificates - isn't that signing off someones else's work every time?
     
  12. Exactly, you prove your competency by doing it right, in accordance with the Part P regulation.
     
  13. This is where part of the problem lies part p is a building reg and not electrical at work regs. Also remember the electrical regs are not a statutory document that is the electrical at work act.

    So if you don’t do the paper work you will be up for building regs but if your work is bad and it kills someone you will be up for electrical at work regs.

    Legally for the electrical work you just have to prove competency under the electricity at work act.
    One way and the most common way is to do this is to do a proper apprenticeship and hold a city and guilds certificate in the latest regulations.

    The periodical inspection report is just that not a certificate on the work carried out and so does not comply with the building regs P and unless you are registered with one of the five companies building control will Except it and will not not sign it off.

    If the home owner is happy not to have the work signed off by building control you may get away with it until they try and sell the house then the buyers solicitor may insist on getting it tested and building control will get involved because the extension has not been signed off.

    this is why I don’t do domestic especially as I only work three days and financially it would never be worth getting Registered
     
    snotty likes this.
  14. You seem to be relating the scenario entirely to Planning Approval work scenarios?

    I did do a time served apprenticeship and I had the 16th Edition Regs when I left the trade at Approved Electrician level, but as I said in the opening post, anyone can do the 18th edition exam with no other knowledge or experience, but they then can't sign work off anyway, so how does that prove competency for the Electricity At Work Act (which only applies to employees/duty holders in a workplace, not a dwelling) so only really applicable whilst works being done? I'd suggest that the definition of competency only ever comes into the equation if something goes wrong?

    I think you do a dis-service to Periodic Inspections - they are vital to most domestic situations as they are the only way of providing certified evidence that the installation is safe at that point in time - there must be hundreds of thousands of houses that don't have any other form of certification (other than a sticker on the Dist Board?) when it comes to renting/selling?

    Edited: I do take your point about Part P Certification - seems to close the door on Periodic Inspection, but is then vague on the Local Authority requirements and their assessment of competence. Seems to be on a job by job basis?
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2019
  15. Bottom line is
    If you do work on a domestic properties that comes under part P of the building regulations (witch is almost everything) and you do not register and pay one of the part P company’s you can not comply and are open to prosecution for not complying with building regs.

    If you do work that doesn’t comply with the latest electrical regs (there has been loads of big changes since the 16th) then you are open to prosecution by the HSE ESC Local Council etc anc could fines or prison
     
  16. Getting back to the original question then I simply haven’t got around to doing 18th yet but need to so not sure. Possibly do it in the lead up to Christmas when I’ve more time. Signed up for an on line tutorial which has mock tests for each part. As for pass rate then it’s a bit hit and miss. I know two sparks who went for the exam and guessed. One passed the other a marginal fail. Not even sure they opened the book to be honest. Mixed bag amongst my lot. About half that have done it have passed. Not good.

    Effectively your not an electrician if you don’t have it but having it doesn’t mean your an electrician! We ask for an NVQ 3 or in old money part 1 and part 2 for a leccy plus regs. Approved need inspection and test! Anything above that need C Certificate or HNC. Qualifying manager type role needs Design/erection/ verification or whatever the newer equivalent is!
     
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  17. Oh yes.. part P... what a load of cobblers.
     
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